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Acosta · Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2004 1:41 am Post subject: The List of Novels

Does anyone know how this was decided that these are the definitive 100 greatest novels? I wonder because, there are literally millions of books written since the dawn of writing itself, and has every one been considered? Has everyone who casted a vote read enough books to make such a judgement? I'm just a bit flustered, as I started reading #1 for just a taste at what would be the holy grail of books, and well.. James Joyce pissed me off. The reason to write is to carry on a story that appeals to the reader, and making sure he understands every inch of the journey from the first to last page. Joyce seems to taunt us with his "mastery of language", by confusing at least me with bizarre quotes from unheard of operas, then he lapses into several different languages with obscure phrases, then he has to throw "contransmagnifandjewbangtantiality" on top of it all.. I like the idea of the "stream-of-conciousness" style of writing, but James Joyce needs to get off his high horse of word power and speak to us like people. There is not a damned soul who walks this earth that understood every word, every quote, every language used in this book without the help of some reference.

Ulysses isn't the only thing that bothered me with the list. I expected some books to be on the list that weren't. Perhaps one of Doyle's Sherlock Holmes novels, Burrough's Tarzan maybe, Dicken's David Copperfield or Tale of Two Cities, or Dumas' Count of Monte Cristo or Three Musketeers? There are so many great books that should be on the list and aren't, and some that appear on the list that just don't hold up to their ranking.
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-Jesse

Acosta · Posted: Tue Dec 07, 2004 1:37 pm Post subject:

Well, I somewhat found some answers to my own questions which might enlighten others as well. I found the audio file on NPR where they discuss the list when it was first released.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=1010546

They had said the list is actually of English written novels written in the 20th century, which explains why some of my novels I ranted were not n there. They also say the list is almost all American authors, which is very interesting, perhaps biased.
They also mention the fact that the oldest novel on the list was written in the '60s, which means omitting quite a few years of good work, merely because they haven't had the years to prove they have "stood the test of time".
Later in the program, they also talk about "genre" novels, and how they are memorable, they might not merit as great. I think thats a bunch of crap, if you remember the characters so well, the story stands out in mind, and the novel is still stands the test of time, its a good book. Thats why they omitted names like Ray Bradbury, Philip K Dick, Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, HG Wells, Edgar Rice Burroughs, etc. I'm actually shocked that 1984 is on the list with this kind of judgement they had made. If 1984 is there, Fahrenheit 451 should also be there as they tackle similar themes.

I also found out with some more research that there is a rival list:
http://www.randomhouse.com/modernlibrary/100rivallist.html

This list was compiled by the Radcliffe Publishing Course, and I'm not sure the extent on which they built the list from. To me, this list has a few better judgements on it. I have always considered Gatsby to be #1, and it is on the list. To Kill a Mockingbird also apears on this rival list, which I think is a good thing even though I personally didn't enjoy the book as much as others. Other books also land on the list like The Color Purple, One Flew Over The Cookoo's Nest, Charlotte's Web, Winnie-The-Pooh, For Whom The Bell Tolls, Lord of The Rings, The Jungle, War of The Worlds, Wind in the Willows, which I think are great additions.

I also found another list, The 100 Greatest Novels of All-Time, compiled by the Observer.
http://observer.guardian.co.uk/review/story/0,6903,1061037,00.html

Again, some of the novels that I had initially rattled off landed here as well.
_________________
-Jesse

shaw · Java Man Joined: 04 Aug 2003 Posts: 1025

Thank you for this info!

jeffp · Posted: Sun Jul 24, 2005 1:45 pm Post subject:

Thanks for posting the links to those other lists.

The Modern Library list very different from the other two, which are both full of books (and authors) that I've never even heard of. Since the Modern Library list contains the Hitchhiker's Guide, I must wonder about it overall. Don't get me wrong... H2G2 is a great book, but is it one of the top 100? I guess it all depends on what you're looking for in your top 100, and that is why the Modern Library list is interestingly different from the others.

I'm not sure I will read any top 100 list just to do it... I read a lot already, and don't need that sort of goal. Besides, why would I want to try reading Joyce or James, given what I've heard about them from numerous sources now?

--jeffp

shaw · Java Man Joined: 04 Aug 2003 Posts: 1025

The modern library list doesn't have h2g2 on it.

jeffp · Posted: Mon Jul 25, 2005 2:49 pm Post subject:

I beg to differ. Here's a quote, taken directly from the page via cut & paste:

72. A Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy by Douglas Adams

--jeffp

shaw · Java Man Joined: 04 Aug 2003 Posts: 1025

We are talking about two different lists.

The first modern library list, "best novels of all time" does not have h2g2 on the list. http://www.randomhouse.com/modernlibrary/100bestnovels.html

You may be looking at a different list.

jeffp · Posted: Tue Jul 26, 2005 9:38 am Post subject:

Apparantly we are looking at different lists. Mine came from here:

shaw · Java Man Joined: 04 Aug 2003 Posts: 1025

jeffp · Posted: Wed Jul 27, 2005 5:11 pm Post subject:

Interesting that the college students were given 400 books to choose from to get their top 100, as if they couldn't pick out good novels without guidance. I'd love to see what they'd have picked as their top 100 if they could choose from anything at all.

Oh well.

My orginal comment here was based on Acosta's post about alternate lists to the one you're reading, so it stands. That "rival" list put together by college students has a completely different feel to it. But I'm still not going to set out to read it all.

--jeffp